Greenfield IPv4 + IPv6 broadband deployment

Brian E Carpenter brian.e.carpenter at
Sun Feb 27 21:16:19 CET 2011


The pending RFC spec for domestic/SOHO IPv6 CPE is a router.

I've seen plenty of domestic NATs mis-sold as "routers" and I think those
vendors will have little choice but to actually deliver routers for IPv6.

   Brian Carpenter

On 2011-02-27 18:04, Frank Bulk wrote:
> I'm just not aware of an ISP that requires a customer to provide their
> router -- if a service provider uses a modem or ONT, the customer is free to
> plug in a router or their PC directly.  At least that's the way it is in
> North America.
> That said, I would say that definitely than 10% and probably less than 5% of
> our customers don't use a router.  I'm not worried about a customer having
> 50 devices -- they would likely have a router in that case.  Most of our
> configs hand out only one IPv4 address, so they're already "programmed" to
> know that if they want multiple devices online the home that they need to
> use a router, and 99.9%, it's a wireless router.
> So I'm aware of the ND concerns, but with our small operations (<8,500
> broadband users across 4 different access platforms), the ND concerns are
> minimal.
> Frank
> -----Original Message-----
> From: Mikael Abrahamsson [mailto:swmike at] 
> Sent: Saturday, February 26, 2011 8:58 PM
> To: Frank Bulk
> Cc: Adam Armstrong; Dan White; IPv6 operators forum
> Subject: RE: Greenfield IPv4 + IPv6 broadband deployment
> On Sat, 26 Feb 2011, Frank Bulk wrote:
>> It's a bit much, in our customer base, to require a router.
> Could you please elaborate on that?
> It's my world view that a majority of people already have a NAT gateway 
> (because they want wifi etc), and the people who don't, do they really 
> need IPv6 connectivity right away? When they want it, they can purchase a 
> router and then have it.
> I just see so many downsides with supporting a vendor routed /64 that I 
> don't see that I can recommend it. Of course, large deployment hasn't 
> happened yet so operationally we don't know what's going to happen.
> If you're going to be the default gw of the /64, I think it's a good idea 
> to enforce what number of IPv6 addresses and mac addresses you support in 
> the service. Handling lots of ND is not going to scale, you really don't 
> want to be part of the home network if you can avoid it. Think 50 devices 
> which might have multiple IPv6 addresses each. That's a lot of ND and TCAM 
> usage.
> I'm sure you can get away with it initially, but isn't it better to do it 
> right from the start than to have to stop doing it and converting the 
> users later?

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